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For those who have or know about pseudoseizures

Fri, 11/05/2010 - 19:00
I have had physiological (ie. not psychogenic) seizures for 6 months, but a 12-year old neighbor of mine who, ah, sees me as role-model (don't ask me why - lol) has suddenly developed psychogenic seizures. It's so obvious it's really sad, and a pediatric neurologist said as much as well. I haven't had any in front of her, however it doesn't take much to see what seizures look like on the internet these days. Under the guidance of the neurologist, her parents and I are working with her on this, and right now the parents are using the "well anyone who has seizures can't do that" approach (play video games, stay up late, swim, eat junk food, you name it). Their next approach is to give her an "AED" (placebo). Anyway, her situation with pseudoseizures has led to questions I have that I would like the folks here who also have pseudoseizures (or know about them) to answer: 1. Do pseudoseizures have a stereotypical pattern of aura, seizure activity, seizure after-effects, etc.? Or, are the seizure-related behaviours for a given seizure type more variable than for physiological seizures? 2. Do pseudoseizures even have aura, and seizure after effects like headache, electrical sensations, etc.? 3. Are AEDs helpful for pseudoseizures? Can one "convince" themselves (consciously or subconsciously) that a particular AED is working, and therefore the seizures seem to come under at least partial control? Or, is the psychological reason for having the seizures too strong for any AED to work? 4. Since very often EEGs, MRIs, etc. can be normal even in those with physiological seizures, how does a neurologist determine that someone is in fact having pseudoseizures (assuming no obvious issues like pre-diagnosed mental disorder, mental or physical trauma, severe stress, etc,)? Thank you in advance for your help!

Comments

Re: For those who have or know about pseudoseizures

Submitted by 3Hours2Live on Mon, 2010-11-08 - 05:15
Hi Zealot, It appears that fictional constructs are too accepted to maintain Popper's empirical falsification. I came across the gross abuse of the notion of "shadows" in the book "Shadow Syndromes" by Ratey and Johnson (1997). The book claims biology, but it is more than lost in Aristophanes' "The Clouds". They can't get either end to study anything real. The shadows of moving objects "displaying" the "Invisibility of the Lorentz Contraction" (James Terrell, Physical Review, Volume 116, Number 4, November 15, 1959, pages 1041-1045; http://www.guspepper.net/electro/Segundo%20semestre/Seminarios/Funez.pdf ), strangely violates something with the possible shadows. With all sets of laws of shadows being subjected to being violated, is there any valid and objective "science" involving shadows? The "directional flow of heat" involving thermodynamics gives another sharp blow to the DSM's radiating "cold" to the shadows. Then the very basics are immediately trammpled, as critics have repeatedly cited to no avail: "First, you must appreciate that the notion of mental disorder is what social scientists call a construct. Constructs are abstract concepts of something that is not real in the physical sense that a spoon or motorcycle or cat can be seen and touched. ... Mental illness is a construct. ... The category itself is an invention, a creation. It may be a good and useful invention, or it may be a confusing one. DSM is a compendium of constructs. And like a large and popular mutual fund, DSM's holdings are constantly changing as the managers' estimates and beliefs about the value of those holdings change." From "Making Us Crazy", by Kutchins and Kirk (1997), pages 22-23. http://books.google.com/books?id=qO1_eDb3viIC&printsec=frontcover&dq=making+us+crazy&hl=en&ei=H63XTNzICI7CsAPj-PWMCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCUQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=constructs&f=false Then, with "Shadow Magic", every single one of our "Quirks, Oddies May Be Illnesses" http://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/04/science/quirks-oddities-may-be-illnesses.html?scp=1&sq=%22Quirks,%20Oddities%20May%20Be%20Illnesses%22&st=cse So, Casper the Friendly Ghost does cast a more than real shadow, more real than himself! The construct forms a continuum (infinite number of points between any two points?), so they better finish-up after they count the possibilities (an infinite number of degrees of Mental Disorders for a finite population, so it's a good thing a few different pills will cure everything under the Sun for Casper). "But neuroscience does tell us that, when it comes to a life well-lived, we must take the existence of a soul on faith." Ibid. Rately, page 366. A welcome to Mary Baker Eddy to practice neurology, but, "Pure materialism, the assumption that we possess no free will at all - that our biology makes us do the things we do - is a working proposition only for those of us fortunate enough to be born with high serotonin levels and a long attention span" Ibid. So, if we understand epilepsy, we're lost, and if we don't, we're still lost, but then "free", if we have a $$$Billion$$$ to be "Free To Choose", and don't choose to waste it on a serotonin high of bad brights. If the light of science is too bright, it's as if everyone better stay in the shadows, and be mentally ill at least a little bit (level to be determined by self-sacrificing panel of experts who have seen the light, excluding Mary Baker Eddy (the "wrong" light, by oligarchical majority rule)). There is a Moby Dick book on philosophy that takes a few dozen pages to "simply" explain the speed of shadows, but a more satirical one is "Shadows: Unlocking Their Secrets, from Plato to Our Time" By Roberto Casati, Abigail Asher (2004): http://books.google.com/books?id=5h7PsLICpm0C&pg=PA46&dq=shadows+move+faster+than+light&hl=en&ei=5xHWTJLNIozSsAO8rviMCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCwQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=shadows%20move%20faster%20than%20light&f=false Epilepsy also helps explain why hot water freezes faster than cold water (I've read the big book on infinite similarities too). Lots of Love, Tadzio P.S. Google Chrome today keeps declaring "Unresponsive Page" plug-ins for 2 to 3 minutes before it defaults and/or freezes on the home page of Psychout.

Re: For those who have or know about pseudoseizures

Submitted by zealot on Mon, 2010-11-08 - 10:22

Tadzio,

I noticed that the home page is loading "funny."  Can you get me a screen pic or some accurate represnentation so I can send it to TypePad support?  That's a real problem.  Maybe it's related to the post with the ilea typo in the url name so the search only turns up the url name in the text of my posts here, but not in the site search for my domain.  Huh.

Let me know if it keeps happening.  I noticed it was really slow last night, but so was everything else.  I thought it was just my haunted equipment.  Caspar's been busy casting shadows.

I keep hammering these same points that other people have been hammering very eloquently for decades.  The $$$ people don't want to hear it because they cannot profit from logic, only illogic.

Our grandchildren will all be speaking Mandarin if this continues.

Btw, when hot water freezes faster than cold, at how many Gs is that?  Does that mean water vapor freezes faster than water?

Baruch Hashem.  Hoshia na.

Devorah Zealot Soodak http://psychout.typepad.com/ the zealot needs help! Please read my blog. Thanks.

Tadzio,

I noticed that the home page is loading "funny."  Can you get me a screen pic or some accurate represnentation so I can send it to TypePad support?  That's a real problem.  Maybe it's related to the post with the ilea typo in the url name so the search only turns up the url name in the text of my posts here, but not in the site search for my domain.  Huh.

Let me know if it keeps happening.  I noticed it was really slow last night, but so was everything else.  I thought it was just my haunted equipment.  Caspar's been busy casting shadows.

I keep hammering these same points that other people have been hammering very eloquently for decades.  The $$$ people don't want to hear it because they cannot profit from logic, only illogic.

Our grandchildren will all be speaking Mandarin if this continues.

Btw, when hot water freezes faster than cold, at how many Gs is that?  Does that mean water vapor freezes faster than water?

Baruch Hashem.  Hoshia na.

Devorah Zealot Soodak http://psychout.typepad.com/ the zealot needs help! Please read my blog. Thanks.

Re: For those who have or know about pseudoseizures

Submitted by zealot on Sat, 2010-11-06 - 20:25

Marty,

Please read this carefully:

"I have had physiological (ie. not psychogenic) seizures for 6 months, but a 12-year old neighbor of mine who, ah, sees me as role-model (don't ask me why - lol) has suddenly developed psychogenic seizures. It's so obvious it's really sad, and a pediatric neurologist said as much as well. I haven't had any in front of her, however it doesn't take much to see what seizures look like on the internet these days. Under the guidance of the neurologist, her parents and I are working with her on this, and right now the parents are using the "well anyone who has seizures can't do that" approach (play video games, stay up late, swim, eat junk food, you name it). Their next approach is to give her an "AED" (placebo)."

  1. The term "physiological seizures" is a new one on me.  Unless you are accusing someone of malingering or having a facticious disorder, even psychogenic seizures have a physiological basis.  There is no difference between psychogenic and physiological except in the eye of the beholder.
  2. "ah, sees me as role-model (don't ask me why - lol)" is a problem in and unto itself.  If she does not consider herself worthy of the role she should remove herself from it.  I believe she has as little respect for herself as she does for the girl.
  3. If she needs to ask what psychogenic seizures are, how does she know that "It's so obvious."
  4. Since the aversive conditioning is so obviously unsuccessful, what makes them think the '"AED" (placebo)' will be any more so?
  5. How did the pediatric neurologist determine that a twelve year old has psychogenic seizures?  Has the girl had a VEEG or AEEG?

You are right that my responses are "uneven."  I was much more upset when I wrote the post at the bottom.  I find a grown woman ridiculing a twelve year old child to be abhorrent.  When I calmed down, I clarified my position.

There is nothing flippant about what I said.  I am not judging her.  I am telling her to stop and butt out before she compounds the damage to the child.  The poor girl is in for a tough road with a neurologist and a "role-model" who so clearly do not have her best interests at heart.

She has one thing right.  It is sad.  Very, very, sad.  But not for the reasons she believes it is.

Baruch Hashem.  Hoshia na.

Devorah Zealot Soodak http://psychout.typepad.com/ the zealot needs help! Please read my blog. Thanks.

Marty,

Please read this carefully:

"I have had physiological (ie. not psychogenic) seizures for 6 months, but a 12-year old neighbor of mine who, ah, sees me as role-model (don't ask me why - lol) has suddenly developed psychogenic seizures. It's so obvious it's really sad, and a pediatric neurologist said as much as well. I haven't had any in front of her, however it doesn't take much to see what seizures look like on the internet these days. Under the guidance of the neurologist, her parents and I are working with her on this, and right now the parents are using the "well anyone who has seizures can't do that" approach (play video games, stay up late, swim, eat junk food, you name it). Their next approach is to give her an "AED" (placebo)."

  1. The term "physiological seizures" is a new one on me.  Unless you are accusing someone of malingering or having a facticious disorder, even psychogenic seizures have a physiological basis.  There is no difference between psychogenic and physiological except in the eye of the beholder.
  2. "ah, sees me as role-model (don't ask me why - lol)" is a problem in and unto itself.  If she does not consider herself worthy of the role she should remove herself from it.  I believe she has as little respect for herself as she does for the girl.
  3. If she needs to ask what psychogenic seizures are, how does she know that "It's so obvious."
  4. Since the aversive conditioning is so obviously unsuccessful, what makes them think the '"AED" (placebo)' will be any more so?
  5. How did the pediatric neurologist determine that a twelve year old has psychogenic seizures?  Has the girl had a VEEG or AEEG?

You are right that my responses are "uneven."  I was much more upset when I wrote the post at the bottom.  I find a grown woman ridiculing a twelve year old child to be abhorrent.  When I calmed down, I clarified my position.

There is nothing flippant about what I said.  I am not judging her.  I am telling her to stop and butt out before she compounds the damage to the child.  The poor girl is in for a tough road with a neurologist and a "role-model" who so clearly do not have her best interests at heart.

She has one thing right.  It is sad.  Very, very, sad.  But not for the reasons she believes it is.

Baruch Hashem.  Hoshia na.

Devorah Zealot Soodak http://psychout.typepad.com/ the zealot needs help! Please read my blog. Thanks.

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